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Post by racinfan83 on Sept 4, 2014 18:00:32 GMT -6
Our lap average speed is 80-95mph depending on track conditions. Aero plays a part for sure. Getting the thing to come off the corner from the slowest point without kicking the rear out and blazing the tires is the key to our issues. We have some ideas to try for tomorrow nite...
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Post by flipflopoo1oo on Sept 4, 2014 18:50:14 GMT -6
A guy gave us a new rim one time when struggling! It weighed 53 pounds! It was a left ft. or lt. rear if slick! It improved our traction and helped from breaking the tires loose when rolled! You could go ahead and stand on it or have less push in its weight factors! It was faster so we chunked it and used the outers to build 2 14 inch rims from some old bent light 12s! Added bite with more cross and went up a pound of air! BINGO--- Faster! You have too find all the little things like light weight steering links, tie rods, collars, bumpers, steer boxes, ect ... to have a good rear weight! Ever wonder about those Aluminum brackets to mount lead with???
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Post by racinfan83 on Sept 5, 2014 7:33:21 GMT -6
The aluminum brackets for lead are what we use. We were told to mount lead "high and right" to help with loose. And we have that. What is your opinion on that? Our car is brand new this year and pretty much state of the art. We have to weigh 2400 with driver so about 2250 with full fuel. With our horsepower - I think a heavy rim like that would cause issues. We are already at the limit of stripping drive hub splines - lost one last year that was aluminum and went to steel ones. We haven't broke one but others in our class have. We race weekly with 4 in the top 10 in UMP National Points and if you throw in Kenny Wallace who is 13th and races with us quite a bit - 5 of top 13. This place is HIGHLY competitive and some big motors....
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Post by confused on Sept 5, 2014 8:05:00 GMT -6
I have had better luck with having lead mounted more to the left for acceleration issues. Try to keep the unsprung weight to a minimum. The higher it becomes, the less control you have of it and the more it affects your shocks and springs.
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Post by flipflopoo1oo on Sept 5, 2014 13:08:21 GMT -6
You start off with the right at a positive to recover the roll! I have seen this correct other issues but best not to have them! A lot of chassis and different set-up have lots of things you could adjust but one effecting 20 more its hard to make a good choice with out ills of three more! Having a bit of lead placed to improve any car is fine by me! I just use all mine low left and rear on my setup as it can be adjusted in most respects with out upsetting more so much elsewhere! Keeping the left ft. wheel planted that is the common spot to adjust with all things moving towards loose or tight from that spot! I try my best not to make anything move and what has to happen does! So I put that to good use in steer on the right side and the added thrust angle makes it get back over if not over come by the left bar rolling up higher than right goes down to! More even when rolled at the bars for two wheel traction during the roll! No left hike and no added steer from the left hike holding it over or steering to get off the turn straighter, (just the left holding its own with the lead placement) while increasing the right drive to match and let roll out do its job at hand! I wish we all had 20 pounds we could remove easily and place elsewhere!!!
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Post by flipflopoo1oo on Sept 5, 2014 13:45:56 GMT -6
Which side did you strip? It should have been both is all I can say or you were using all left drive or hit a slick spot or hole to strip the right side! A loose bearing eats them right up after a wreck! We twisted more axles inside with all the lead and being hooked, the in and out reverse torque flex! Idled it up and it quit breaking! It was faster that way, free through the turn and faster off! As long as the carb. didn't slobber from the Gs it increased! Always the change to deal with!
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Post by racinfan83 on Sept 6, 2014 7:13:37 GMT -6
Stripped the left side.
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Post by flipflopoo1oo on Sept 6, 2014 8:33:07 GMT -6
I guess we almost all use more left than right and why doesn't make much sense to me other than we just don't like losing so much and want more! Isn't the right the first one to spin by torque applied lifting the tire? Its a good thing they are locked together isn't it!!! I use the right to under steer to straighten, to get off the corner while most over steer and use left rear to straighten it up getting off with more steer added placing traction of tires scuffing down the track unless on three wheels all the time to even out traction! Traction has a heavy cost but lead is worth more placed rear for traction than the gold spent on tires!!!
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Post by flipflopoo1oo on Oct 4, 2014 17:33:55 GMT -6
Extending the rear frame and body with a better rear percentage and less down force needed added few pounds to one new chassis we ran and was easier to lift the total car to get air under to be lighter down the straights! It was set-up soft and was a little radical in movement but it was fast on slick tracks with dust rolling off them! Holes got the better of it and had to go back tighter! It looked flat but high in the air when on the throttle! It looked like you had 4 air bags on it going up and down! A bit too much float on top end to drive in hard and set down once in the corner! It was hooked though! A limited mod W link stock rears! Both rear uppers were up hill and trying to pull down while lifting! The transfer was great with nothing altered! Surprised me too but we gave it a shot! It won 3 in a row before being trashed by ruff track conditions! This should say something about locking movement to be able to transfer more bite instead of lifting just the rear!
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Post by flipflopoo1oo on Oct 11, 2014 9:25:27 GMT -6
Tight - loose can be tire compounds changing traction by heat from one side to the other! Grooving some times cures this if done correctly and allowed! Roll out also can kick in or out with traction! Some claim shocks heating up can do the same! Just getting in the corner different can change the tires! Some times doing a hard left more than twice in a row heats the right rear and changes poundage trickling down to set-up changing during the race! Some make as many as 8 laps and then out of the blue loose it completely for no good reason or not even in the turn! A good balance of traction and weight transfer still needs all the rest to be correct to last all night with no changes needed!
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Post by flipflopoo1oo on Dec 21, 2014 13:43:55 GMT -6
Back to this common issue of tight loose in that order is mostly due to incorrect use of the j-bar angle to start with! Too much and it holds the left side down and when in the throttle turns it loose with the side force pushing hard upwards before thrust traction on the left is achieved! It can happen just starting to raise the rpms and drag downwards goes away! A more neutral setting with less angle(once finding its free spot in the roll) can let you find the other causes! The most critical one being too much left drive or lack of right side drive by pounds or thrust angle of steer bars! I never had to be up on the bars to have traction and never wanted more left gain than right gain to push or over steer the car in the wrong direction!
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Post by flipflopoo1oo on Dec 27, 2014 18:00:06 GMT -6
If switching drive wheels and pounds as well as steer and thrust angles it does get complicated! This is why I have found a way to maintain left rear and only increase the right when lifting and then increase both rears with better transfer for correct steer and traction while in and off the corners! How many ways of steer can you see happening during the drop and in what direction is this better? I just can't see any advantage in things most are doing just to turn left or have more traction! I can see they need more than what they have on one wheel!!!
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Post by flipflopoo1oo on Dec 27, 2014 18:00:44 GMT -6
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Post by flipflopoo1oo on Dec 27, 2014 18:02:20 GMT -6
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Post by volksmech on Apr 30, 2015 7:42:00 GMT -6
The thing that cought my eye was 3 inches of stager on a dry skick...... I thought for dry slick rear was supposed to be 1 to 1.5 inches of stagger. 3 inches of rear stagger should be killing you.
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