Wissota B mod trying swing arms, basic 3 link help

So many aspects in the springs and leverage that preloads and compressed heights of their working ranges with out knowing the total and varriations in splits between them gets complicated fast! Trying to hold left rear by having so much and little tranfer to the right rear leaves you needing a more balance poundage at both the rear tires! You have so little split up front to hold your cross as to not loose traction of the right rear driving you off the corner! A bit more caster should give more up and down in the swing and add transfer if your springs in the front do not just give to the motion! Transfer to swing arms is greatly asborbed by the leverage if not strong enough to react! So many worry about keeping left rear but it needs little but as to the ballance of rear traction with both tires pulling!!! Then with a closer balance of power it can be deligated as to steer and drive! The more leverage factors asorbing the less control the steering has on poundage and transfer to give you control!

mn09,

One thing that I try to do is run a very even setup in the car and this seems to help with forward traction Keep ride heights within 1/8" all around and limit the split across the front. I try to stay within 10-20 lbs between the front tires. I run maybe 100 lbs LR bite max without the driver. You are probably close if not less than what I have for driver included.

Something I learned this year was to limit the rear steer. If the LR is hiking excessively this will kill forward traction. Since IMCAers can run limit chains now, I toyed with taking hike out of the car and it has done wonders for the forward traction department.

My second thought, limit the amount of stagger, again, back to keeping an even setup. 1.5" max in the rear is what I target. Mind you I'm running on dry slick tracks. If your on tack, you may need that stagger to help turn the car. Also, I dont run any offset in the rear. Keep the right side tires aligned. I think this helps the car turn while keeping stagger down. I have had to trail the RR by 1.5" to 2" to get the car to turn in the middle. Some people will shout at me for this and it goes against my 'even setup' strategy but something I do to compensate for lack of stagger but improved forward traction.

Russ

Granted what I do is different than most by not hiking the left rear or toating the left front but afer so many years and classes to have won so much its hard to think otherwise as many who ventured to understand won many all over the us this past year! The theory of it working still holds true applied to any class! I get lost in all the different replies! Mine and others as to the varables in motion! Little is needed if weight can be applied threw the springs to the tires! The caster is to lift or lower each ft. corner to apply or release pounds at all four wheels during the steer process at the drivers steering wheel! This gives the driver control and not at the mercies of the track or turns with G-forces! They are there and do play an important part of why do this or that and ofcourse why not to as well! As far as your 2" offset rear it has a tendency to be there to trip the roll factors of the j-bar pushing up on the left rear and letting the diff. torque lift it even higher to get up on the bars to try to replace the traction lost by getting off the spring and loosing cross or trying to gain more to have left rear to drive the car! The abundance of left rear drive pushes the car to the right! So you need it sideways and on three wheels to get to more of a tetered ballance of rear traction! This is inhanced by the excessive roll over while in the corners! Transitions between has many a bad habbit in finding that sweet spot! I try to leave and hold left rear and match out the rear drive by adding to the right drive instantly when lifting the throttle to be planted before the roll by nosing the right ft. first putting more weight on the left ft. and switching the cross or at least matching it out while in the turn to have all fours planted firmly to maintain control by the ballance that caster gives in the swing and twist of the frame to apply pounds at each cornner as needed for dirrection of steer matching pounds needed for steer and drive to allow roll out to do its job of pushing the car left around the turn! It seems a bit wasted if sideways as reverse stager would work better to straight a sideways car up off the corner as they are trying to do with left rear drive! The car stays straight and rolls freely straight ahead! Many are amazed at being passed on the high side on all fours while they are still sideways and toating a wheel high in the air! Do a little more reading of my post in every class to get a better understanding of why I see things this way! I spent a lot of years changing this and that because of poor designs only to get back to basics and win first time out with old school logic! Wish I could jut fax you a set-up but each design has its quirks! Trust your simple logic applied to each part adressed in motion and transfer! 6-10 caster with the uppers behind on both sides! If you have a fourway that is a even cross, use it as to extreme to see how the steer raises or lowers the spindle to tire and see what effect it has to transfer just by steering right or left to help it roll, let it roll or bring it back and think of the gift of four wheel steering and how little is needed to get it to turn or straighten up with pounds changing in sequence with steer and roll with both rears pulling!!!

I love the B mods for the fact that they are so adjustable but at the same time two different setups can get you to the same place. Heres my two sense:

I think you are too stiff on your rear springs, I have built a model that I can email you to show you why a 250 on the rr is way to heavy. I would stay in the 200 area max. With a 250 the car wont actually compress the spring enough to put the downforce onto the right rear. When you lighten the springs they will crush more (obviously) but what many people don't know is the force on the spring isn't linear its actually exponential. Thus you can have a 150 lb spring produce more force than a 250lb spring (in a race car at least).

Another thing that I see that can cause the car to not bite is your lr trailing arm. I found that when my car goes under 20* it loses drive. I run my lr bar at 34* which I feel is the sweet spot. The rr bar is the only bar (besides the panhard) that I ever change and it can range from 0* to 15* depending on how slick or tacky it is.

Hope this helps,

Wylde