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Post by speedfreak on Mar 14, 2014 6:05:20 GMT -6
Through my research for street stock set ups on wet/heavy tracks versus dry/slick tracks I have found conflicting posts on different forums. On wet/heavy some say move the lead low and left then some say move lead to the right. On the dry/slick track - some say move lead up high and too the right, and some say move lead to the left. My question is - where should the lead blocks be for each track surface condition. I dont have jacking bolts, so I must move my lead around. I am looking for two set-ups - one for heavy/wet/tacky, and other for dry, dusty, slick. Appreciate the help.
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Post by flipflopoo1oo on Mar 14, 2014 7:40:32 GMT -6
I have seen this done too, but I never had to and never wanted to as for its ills! Left side springs should be preloaded awaiting the chance to release and lift with the turn of the steering to the left! If having problems track to track or surface, you may have too much left weight or not enough cross to allow the car to roll! A taller left front tire, or swapping ft roll out will add preload to the left ft but takes away cross! Rear roll out should be more on a tacky track 3-4", but this too lowers cross but is better getting off and lessens left rear as to preload and traction! The only way to fix this is by putting all you weight low, rear, left to preload lerf rear while adding cross! Then and only then will you have less ills track to track if your splits and springs are correct for each axle weight ft to rear! Just changing roll out then will work just fine by shifting and preloading the correct springs as to set-up! Please read all the post to get a better understanding of spring splits per car! The rates of transfer makes the spring fight for position in poundage as well as ride heights! If you have 3" roll out on the rear, a taller lt ft may help pending set-up!
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Post by startnonthetail on Mar 14, 2014 14:46:48 GMT -6
Through my research for street stock set ups on wet/heavy tracks versus dry/slick tracks I have found conflicting posts on different forums. On wet/heavy some say move the lead low and left then some say move lead to the right. On the dry/slick track - some say move lead up high and too the right, and some say move lead to the left. My question is - where should the lead blocks be for each track surface condition. I dont have jacking bolts, so I must move my lead around. I am looking for two set-ups - one for heavy/wet/tacky, and other for dry, dusty, slick. Appreciate the help. Generally, left and low for heavy track...higher for slick. If just raising higher for slick is not enough, then start moving the weight further right, keeping it up high. You move your weight in an "L" shaped pattern. From low left to high left to high right as the track goes from heavy to slick.
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Post by flipflopoo1oo on Mar 14, 2014 20:00:37 GMT -6
Too many other factors as to a correct answer per car based on were it is now! I never move anything track to track! Spacers only to put a different off-set wheel back where I wanted it to start with! If you need a wild guess of a educated sort, you will have to scale the car and give me the spring and shock package as well as air and pounds of weight per wheel is! No two cars depending on these and much more things, alter 20 things each as to help or not! Rear for traction, high for roll and right for roll if you want more! This may help if your car is other wise OK! My fuel tank location changes some 80 lbs. In a 20 lap race so I put it where it works to add left rear weight and lighten right side as to add cross and lean the car more left while adding cross to allow a easer roll with added steer angle on the right side but closing the rear steer to straighten up off the corner! The left front also lifts easier with less load on the right rear spring. All this with changing during the race! While most have to slow down as loosing rear percent or getting looser if mounted incorrectly per set-up, 4th place and two good laps has won countless wins on this loss of rear weight! No guessing, just think about this your-self until you answer your on question! Wish I had a easy answer for you! More info on lean might help! I set all one inch left ft. and 1/2-3/4 rear as to get rear bars in a steering mode! Read all my post in all classes as it works the same on my set-up on all classes!
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Post by speedfreak on Mar 15, 2014 7:48:09 GMT -6
Here are scaling numbers for the early season 1/2 mile - slight banked dirt track w/ 3200 min. weight metric monte. What do you think iyo? LF-856 LR-915 RR-774 RF-676 Left%-54.9 Rear%-52.4 Cross%-49.3 total -3220 p.s.i. LF-15 LR-17 RR-23 RF-23 w/ beadlocs offsets 2" RF 3" the rest springs LF-1000 RF-1200 RR-200 LR-225 Most of the time pretty good. Most of the time dry-slick. Half the time loose coming out of turn.
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Post by flipflopoo1oo on Mar 15, 2014 9:23:56 GMT -6
The numbers are close but the cross is low making it flat (52-54)! Left side is high making it hard to roll and when it does making it roll harder coming off!Springs are soft on the rear weight by 25 pounds compared to fighting the front! You need all the caster you can get as to moving upper ball-joints to the rear to twist the frame when steering to loosen or tighten! Air pressure is high as you need 6-8 inches of outer tread measurement at floor contact! Air is like springs too as to working ranges rf 14-15 rr 13-14 or more if needed, lt ft.12 and lr 9-10! 1-2" rollout ft and rear to preload the springs! Leaned left in the front, measuring on side ft behind wheel frame one inch and rear 1/2-3/4" in front of rear wheel, will put rear steering arms in a working range! up for more and down for less! Bolt to bolt 1/4 left 3/4 plus or minus a 1/4, higher on the ft bolt as to set ride heights! On the ft tie rods should level when rolled with 3/4 toe out! Shocks are the timing of when and how quick it happens! A stiffer left ft. than rt ft by 2-3 points les say a 7lt and a 5rt or softer if needed with 3 to 5s across the rear even with all being non split valve shocks! A 200SA is adjustable as to get a variation! Good luck! Just the increase of caster alone 6 lt 12 right gives the driver control if close and he can add traction by turning right! Add all weight low and left for traction only over coming any sling! 150 lbs on most as to get the rear percent up for less of a nose going in and not getting off the set-up!
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Post by speedfreak on Mar 16, 2014 5:19:11 GMT -6
Thanks for the input, but your wording is a little hard to understand. I thought cross should be 48 - 50 wet/tacky and increase to 50 - 52 when its dry/slick? Also, how would I reduce left side weight, but still keep LR heavy for bite? How much split between rear springs?
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Post by flipflopoo1oo on Mar 16, 2014 6:37:06 GMT -6
Depending on driver weight and fuel tank location and total left percent 25-50lbs! 50-75 gets the left ft. wheel off the ground and I would rather use it to preload and hold right rear tension in balancing rear traction coming off as not to have a push! Getting off straight or being able to drive under anyone less-able with too much steer hiking on left drive or just loose and yes pushing too! Being able to get threw the turn with-out being sideways and still drivable while deep in the throttle! Cross is the pivot across rt. ft. to left rear allowing lean more easily and holding left rear as the transfer pivots to right rear giving equal traction! Roll out takes over to help turn under throttle. Caster allows you with wheel in hand to control steer and traction to each rear wheel from a centered location by twisting the frame! Once to this point wet or dry is just a little more turn of the steering wheel, if all springs are of the right poundage per car and rolled compressed heights are equalizing all 4 to the good of traction and balance allowing you to handle the rest! Its the car that is complicated and they are a handful sometimes! To get a grip, study all terms related to definitions of what they are! Keep asking!
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Post by Toywagon on Mar 18, 2014 18:54:06 GMT -6
Speed are your scale numbers with you in the seat, or without driver? Are you running race tires, or street radials?
Jim
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Post by speedfreak on Apr 1, 2014 4:57:11 GMT -6
In the seat on race tires
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