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side bite
Dec 3, 2013 19:43:22 GMT -6
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Post by zerot on Dec 3, 2013 19:43:22 GMT -6
On a dry slick track ill be around 200 220 on bite with zero stagger on the rear and the car just wants to slide on entry. It's tight so I do flick it to get it to turn otherwise it just pushes. I'll baby the throttle up off but it just doesn't want to hook. Old 1300rf 1150lf 225lr 175rr 15 inch. Any ideas?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 3, 2013 20:50:09 GMT -6
What are your wheel offsets? Need the front as wide as you can get, like 2" offsets and maybe add 1" spacer on the RF, and the Right rear needs to be sucked in as far as you can get it. The RR tire can be a fingers width off the frame rail and not rub because as the car turns left the bottom of the tire bulls inward not the top. It works the other way on the Left rear. The more bite you run the more stagger you will need. As the Bite goes up, the car should be loose off throttle as you lift for entry. The Added Stagger will keep it rolling through the center and the wheel offset will give you the sidebite you need to keep the speed up. All the weight needs to be as high as you can get it. Fuel cell above frame rails, all lead up high etc, etc. All will aide side bite and help keep the speed up in the corner, but it all has to work together. The added sidebite alone wont help if you dont have enough stagger to keep it all rolling.
Dave
Dave.
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side bite
Dec 3, 2013 21:24:23 GMT -6
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Post by clbaker25x on Dec 3, 2013 21:24:23 GMT -6
Consider softening up your front springs ( I know I always say that, but guys I know around here are running around 850/900 for front springs with over 200 pounds of bite.
This is for an imca stock car class on Hoosier G60 tires.
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side bite
Dec 4, 2013 9:54:41 GMT -6
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Post by zerot on Dec 4, 2013 9:54:41 GMT -6
1 inch wheel spacer on rf with 2 offs all the way around except rr 3 off. Lead is high left to middle left about 1 foot behind axle. Fuel cell is high and so is battery. With 2 1/2 inches of stagger in front. When I opened up the stagger for the feature it felt like I lost drive up off the corner. Shocks lf 40-40 rf 60-40 lr 80-20 gas rr 40-40. Got about 1/2 of lead in the rear end. Big 3/8 track lakeside speedway. When I drove this setup I had a run of 5 or 6 top threes in a row. But the car was ridicules through the center and coming up off.
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Post by startnonthetail on Dec 4, 2013 16:38:33 GMT -6
On a dry slick track ill be around 200 220 on bite with zero stagger on the rear and the car just wants to slide on entry. It's tight so I do flick it to get it to turn otherwise it just pushes. I'll baby the throttle up off but it just doesn't want to hook. Old 1300rf 1150lf 225lr 175rr 15 inch. Any ideas? Do you know your weight percentages?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 4, 2013 20:22:18 GMT -6
On a dry slick track ill be around 200 220 on bite with zero stagger on the rear and the car just wants to slide on entry. It's tight so I do flick it to get it to turn otherwise it just pushes. I'll baby the throttle up off but it just doesn't want to hook. Old 1300rf 1150lf 225lr 175rr 15 inch. Any ideas? Do you know your weight percentages? I always liked a 3" Offset on the LR, just felt like we could get back to the gas quicker with the LR tucked in close. If you have room I would get a 4 offset for the RR when it slicks off. If you have to add a 1/2 spacer for clearance, still better than the 3" in the slick. Dave
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side bite
Dec 5, 2013 10:54:06 GMT -6
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Post by zerot on Dec 5, 2013 10:54:06 GMT -6
Lf 749 rf757 lr 968 rr 758. 53.3 left, rear, and cross
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Post by startnonthetail on Dec 5, 2013 12:53:38 GMT -6
IMO, your wheel weights are textbook.
I would be suspicious that your springs actually rate what they say. Sounds just like you've got a weak RF spring.
Next thing I would ask about (if I was in charge of your car setup) would be caster/camber and ride heights.
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side bite
Dec 5, 2013 14:35:06 GMT -6
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Post by zerot on Dec 5, 2013 14:35:06 GMT -6
I like to keep my lf heavier than rf generally. I think the rf spring is bad also. Had to constantly raise the rf tide height every week is ever other week. My car was hoping on entry also no matter if I drove in smooth or drove in hard as Hell. With new shocks out still did this. I'll post caster and camber settings when I get home.
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side bite
Dec 5, 2013 14:50:13 GMT -6
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Post by zerot on Dec 5, 2013 14:50:13 GMT -6
This is a heavy night. Start outside row 2 blue and yellow 0t car. You can see what I'm talking about towards the end of the video. Start around 7:30 mark.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZZaMGwQyd0s&feature=youtube_gdata_player
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 5, 2013 20:13:59 GMT -6
What brand of springs and shocks are you using?
Dave
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Post by Deleted on Dec 5, 2013 20:54:17 GMT -6
One thing I notice in the video is the car stays very flat. It looks good but you need to get it rolling over to aide the side bite. I have found one of the biggest problems with the metric is the rear end in a bind that keeps it from rolling over. Best way to check is to get the car on jack stands, let the rear suspension hang down. Remove the wheels, shocks and springs. With a guy on each side of the rear, grab the axles and try to move the rear up and down in a figure eight, one side up, other down. If it doesnt flop around easily while making the figure eight motion, something is binding and limiting its motion. Fix that and things will get much better. If you run solid type bushings (not mono balls)common problem is to tight on the mount bolts. Leave them loose and drill the nuts so you can put a cotter pin through to secure them. very easy to over tighten these bolts and create a bind. As for the bouncing. If you arent on Bielstien shocks, you should be. worth every cent. And if you are, send them out to get checked. I like Eibach springs. If you went to 1000 RF and 850 LF and re scaled, keeping your percentages the same and your front weight split left to right the same, the car would drive like you are used to but have more roll and aide your side bite. Just some things to think about.
Dave
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side bite
Dec 5, 2013 21:46:17 GMT -6
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Post by zerot on Dec 5, 2013 21:46:17 GMT -6
I double nut the trailing arm bolts both upper and lower making sure there free. I think the rear end is in a huge bind. The guy that builds my shocks uses bilsteins or qa1. Afco front springs several years old. Eibach rear springs New this year.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 6, 2013 2:36:26 GMT -6
I double nut the trailing arm bolts both upper and lower making sure there free. I think the rear end is in a huge bind. The guy that builds my shocks uses bilsteins or qa1. Afco front springs several years old. Eibach rear springs New this year. Afco springs are the most inconsistent pieces of crap I have ever seen, and 3 yrs old? well......... Replace the front springs with eibach, at the very least the car will be more predictable. Keeping the rear free is so important. Those upper mounts bend a little and it screws up everything. Dave
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side bite
Dec 6, 2013 13:13:56 GMT -6
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Post by zerot on Dec 6, 2013 13:13:56 GMT -6
Yeah in tear down this winter I noticed the uppers had put u huge bind in the rear end. I heard eibach has good product so I'll go with them all the way around the car. On another point. When you tighten your car up by jacking weight or lower car angles. I personally deal with a track that goes real heavy to dry slick. So I'll leave the lf heavy by about 80 pounds on the scales for the heat then put a couple in lr and take couple out rr putting my scale numbers right where I want them for the feature. We are on the American racer g60 and had a very hard time finding stagger this last 2 years. Seems like all the tires end up within a 1/2 inch of each other. Made it hard to adjust the car with stagger is what I'm getting at.
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