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Post by peterdragon on Jun 9, 2014 13:30:52 GMT -6
dry is good and fast but on the heavy track it wants to wheelie up and at times on one wheel
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Post by startnonthetail on Jun 9, 2014 15:11:54 GMT -6
The more you can get that front up in the air, the better forward bite you will have! I wouldn't worry about it unless it is so bad that you can't steer the car.
If that's the case, increase RR spring rate or take some bite out of the LR to keep from three-wheelin so bad.
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Post by flipflopoo1oo on Jun 9, 2014 18:48:44 GMT -6
Which one wheel are you on and where on the track? Too much rear split allows pivot threw the high cross and the weight shift lifts the left front up easily! Too much rear percent along with the air under the car and traction lifts the right up too! The one wheel should be the right rear with right side thrust in turning left and torqueing over! I saw this happen once before to win in the late model class and many more times in going straight to the rear! A little less j-bar angle and less left side bar angle or just move the pull bar up away from the axle! If jerking up at once, try a stiffer shock package! A 5th arm car if doing this could use a softer spring and stiffer shock! Bird cage indexing when hiking may also be sending it flying on the left or dropping hard on the right sending all the traction to the right rear with all the weight also! Move some weight low and left that is making too much shift quickly! Try a little more off-set on the right rear also! I never use easy up shocks on the front as to pulling both front wheels and leaving no steer!
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Post by Deleted on Jun 14, 2014 18:42:13 GMT -6
Its has alot to do with weight placement. Percentages alone, dont tell the whole story. Two cars can have the same %'s but have the weight is much different places. I had 50lbs of lead on the left side in front of the drivers feet and as high as I could mount it to keep the LF on the ground. You just cant hang lead on the bumper to get your rear and left. This is why you build everything as light as you can, so you have the leeway to put the lead where it needs to be and still come in at min weight.
Dave
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Post by seventyfour on Jun 15, 2014 23:26:46 GMT -6
Does it push? Are you burning the RR? Is you problems limited only to exit?
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Post by flipflopoo1oo on Jun 16, 2014 4:46:43 GMT -6
It's just rocking over because of less tension by drop of the right or too much lifting the left changing the cross to a higher pivot and the curves momentum tilts it over! Too much J-bar angle lets the rear end slide through and changes roll center while sending the left side upwards! I have seen 3500 pound clunkers tote the left ft. a foot high with to much variation drop of the right rear spring! Look and see if yours has fallen out or the spring perch or location is indexing wrong! Calm down the left hike with the lower arm at a negative angle with out loosing drive if you must! If your weight is not low and left and rear the car will loose left rear when nosing or rolled by not pulling the right side down to help pull the car left when lifting or slow to transfer weight when on the throttle! If the left rear poundage stays where you want it for traction with no waiting on turning or throttle transfer or hike to put back the pounds you lost by falling through your cross, you are staying hooked to the track at all times! You can drive in over your head with out loosing control knowing it will move forward even if sliding sideways and straighten up off the corner at a higher rate of speed even on a dry-slick track! We have passed 3-5 cars up to speed in one turn! No rails or strings attached keeping you high or low! More of a snake motion to get through the traffic! Drivable in the turn on or off the gas with good ole mother nature doing her thing as normal! She has been racing longer than I have! She is on my speed dial! Check out her web page on forward motion!
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Post by Deleted on Jun 16, 2014 11:55:53 GMT -6
It's just rocking over because of less tension by drop of the right or too much lifting the left changing the cross to a higher pivot and the curves momentum tilts it over! Too much J-bar angle lets the rear end slide through and changes roll center while sending the left side upwards! I have seen 3500 pound clunkers tote the left ft. a foot high with to much variation drop of the right rear spring! Look and see if yours has fallen out or the spring perch or location is indexing wrong! Calm down the left hike with the lower arm at a negative angle with out loosing drive if you must! If your weight is not low and left and rear the car will loose left rear when nosing or rolled by not pulling the right side down to help pull the car left when lifting or slow to transfer weight when on the throttle! If the left rear poundage stays where you want it for traction with no waiting on turning or throttle transfer or hike to put back the pounds you lost by falling through your cross, you are staying hooked to the track at all times! You can drive in over your head with out loosing control knowing it will move forward even if sliding sideways and straighten up off the corner at a higher rate of speed even on a dry-slick track! We have passed 3-5 cars up to speed in one turn! No rails or strings attached keeping you high or low! More of a snake motion to get through the traffic! Drivable in the turn on or off the gas with good ole mother nature doing her thing as normal! She has been racing longer than I have! She is on my speed dial! Check out her web page on forward motion! This is great advice! To much J bar angle, Indexing wrong, Lower arm angle adjustments. This guy is in such a hurry to post BS on every thread, that he cant even keep track of what kind of car he is giving advice on! Oh ya the "snake motion" to get through traffic, priceless! Dave
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Post by flipflopoo1oo on Jun 16, 2014 14:00:13 GMT -6
Clunker about covers it and you may have not seen a late model run in a street stock class but I have! Track rules and regulations do vary greatly in our area! A four banger moved up a class or two from my help until super stock said no more shaming us! Not allowed in mods! I do things a bit different, granted! Too much variation in any movement other than forward can be a handful to deal with! Our 4bar would hop and clear all four tires if gassed to quickly going in the corner but it landed straight an continued on its way to the front! What you may learn in lower classes will apply as you progress threw the classes! Drivability in the turn is key to passing and metric cars are four bars! Leaning right or left, up or down, drive angles do apply! After helping so many win in every class, I do feel qualified to answer! Most BS accepted! Any top drivers who got to hot lap one of our cars said,( NO WONDER WHY YOU ALWAYS WIN SO MUCH )! DRIVEABILITY! Let the car do the work! Passing 37 running cars when starting 17th with 7 cautions and finishing 3rd after passing 3 on the last lap is what I call good hard racing first night out, new used chassis, mid season, B-mod class V6! Do the math! It's no fun just winning out front all the way! Drive-ability! No BS here!
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Post by Deleted on Jun 17, 2014 8:12:55 GMT -6
Metric cars are four bars! Leaning right or left, up or down, drive angles do apply! No that is where you are wrong. Metric cars are not 4 bar cars. They are a stock "W" setup and the arms were designed to work against each other to keep the rearend centered in the car. That being said, they don't like to move very much away from there stock angles or major binds occur. The rearends don't rotate but a few degrees under acceleration, it is a vary limited design. This is a street stock thread, so one has to assume that you aren't running a Latemodel or a Sportsman car unless otherwise stated. Once again, you never really answer a single question anyone asks. Once again you just spew generalities and avoid specific answers. There can only be one conclusion, ...... I can tell you have great experience running clunkers against bigger clunkers, but Im in the Midwest, at the center of UMP Dirtcar country, we race serious cars, your BS just doesn't hold water here. Dave.
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Post by seventyfour on Jun 17, 2014 10:05:04 GMT -6
Does it push? Are you burning the RR? Is you problems limited only to exit? . How much bite do you have (crossweight percentage?
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Post by peterdragon on Jul 24, 2014 8:23:06 GMT -6
220 bite 54.5 balanced yes exit only
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Post by startnonthetail on Jul 24, 2014 10:11:59 GMT -6
220 bite 54.5 balanced yes exit only So, have you tried anyone's suggestions yet? How's the car now?
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Post by peterdragon on Jul 24, 2014 14:52:08 GMT -6
GUESS IM OVERLOOKING THE suggestions I REALLY CANT PICK UP WHAT FLIPFLOP IS LAYING DOWN! IM MORE CONFUSED THAN A COW ON ASTRO TURF!! I HAVE CHANGED THE CAR AND ITS BETTER BUT NOW IM LOOSE AS HELL ON ENTRY 50%CROSS 50 REAR 51 LEFT SIDE 1000-1200--200-175 2975 TOTAL
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Post by flipflopoo1oo on Jul 24, 2014 17:16:19 GMT -6
51-53 better cross and left numbers should help! Having the left ft. loaded 50-200with driver should help it to roll and plant right rear as not to be loose! The left rear lead I speak of holds left rear from rolling up and loosing but rather gaining right rear in the nose and roll process! Needs a fair rear percent to work! Added weight never slowed us one bit in gains it presented to handling and traction! Ask all you need as to how it works! About 60- 80 bite changes when on the throttle with the lead there as the transfer takes place to hook both rears equally and lets roll-out do the rest!
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Post by startnonthetail on Jul 25, 2014 10:01:55 GMT -6
GUESS IM OVERLOOKING THE suggestions I REALLY CANT PICK UP WHAT FLIPFLOP IS LAYING DOWN! IM MORE CONFUSED THAN A COW ON ASTRO TURF!! I HAVE CHANGED THE CAR AND ITS BETTER BUT NOW IM LOOSE AS HELL ON ENTRY 50%CROSS 50 REAR 51 LEFT SIDE 1000-1200--200-175 2975 TOTAL Swapping the front springs should help loose on entry.
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